Chatting with Loretta Robinson: Naskapi Niistim & Competency 15

In this episode, we meet with Naskapi educator Loretta Robinson from Kawawachikamach.  Loretta Robinson explores how education deepens when reconnected to the land, and how children thrive when their learning honours their own rhythm, language, and relationships.

Loretta begins by honouring us with stories of her childhood in Kawawachikamach—gathering medicines, listening to aunties, and witnessing a herd of caribou stride across a frozen lake. Those memories shaped her vision for the Naskapi Niistim program. This youth program, translated as  "Naskapi first", is rooted in Naskapi language, stories, the land and the caribou, placing Naskapi culture at the center. Daily practices like morning fires, seasonal teachings, and emotional check-ins in Naskapi help children nurture self-awareness and weave language into practical, lived moments.

Loretta also discussed the creation of Competency 15, designed to support Quebec educators in transitioning from a position of expert to that of learner. The "two rivers, one canoe" metaphor serves as a tool for reflection, encouraging teachers to thoughtfully integrate curriculum requirements with Indigenous knowledge systems while honouring the integrity and depth of both. Educators are invited to continually examine where they are in this ongoing journey of learning and relationship-building.

We concluded by exploring 'The Day on the Land' professional development initiative, which invites educators to Kawawachikamach to experience this approach in practice. Local Knowledge Keepers and Elders guide this experience. Educators interested in attending are encouraged to talk to their administrators and directors of education about the opportunities available to them. 

Transcript

Welcome

Stacy 0:06

Welcome to Hello- Kwey, Let's Talk Education, a podcast where Indigenous and non-Indigenous voices from across Quebec come together to share knowledge and experiences related to education. In each episode, you'll encounter new perspectives that we hope will enrich your practice and deepen your connection to your communities. In this episode, I will be meeting with Loretta Robinson to discuss the Naskapi Niistim Program, Competency 15, and the Day on the Land Initiative that is taking place in Kawawachikamach. So thank you, Loretta, for joining me today. I'm super excited to actually meet you because I've heard a lot about some of the work you've been doing through Rebekah Goertzen

Kawawachikamach and Growing Up On The Land

Stacy 1:01

and a few of the other people I've been working with. To begin, I was wondering if you could tell me a bit about yourself and maybe a bit about Kawawa, because I've been to Shefferville on my milk runs to Kuujjuaq, but I've never actually been out of the airport. So I'd love to learn a bit about more about your community.

Loretta 1:19

Sure. (Loretta introduces herself in Naskapi) . So I said is Wachiya, which is a way of saying hello, and greeting people in Naskapi. My name is Loretta Robinson. I'm Naspaki woman Kawawachikamach. And it's an honor to be here today to share our vision of what we want for our children in our community of Kawawachikamach. So I was born and raised in Kawawa, really connected to the land, you know, the the caribou, hearing stories around the caribou, picking medicines with my mom, my aunties, going caribou hunting with my dad from a very young age, I'd say at six, seven, I would go on these hunting trips with my dad, where he would put me to work, you know, like if he if we got some pharmigans, white pharmigans, we hunt in the winter. My job would be to gather them and put them in our bag, you know, things, little things like that. And so my weekends really involved that, you know, these little family get-togethers on the land, we were always brought together by food. And so my at that time as a little girl would be like, you know, wandering on the land and and just thinking about, you know, what I was where I was standing and what I was seeing. And then when I would be sitting around the fire with my aunties or my mom, just listening to these stories. And so at a very young age, I heard these stories. And it's been part big part of who I am as a Naskapi woman and also a Cree woman. My father is from northern Manitoba, but he was he moved to Kawawa and raised us there. And so with that, you know, it I really at a very young age had a sense of who I was as a Naskapi woman and a Cree. But also, of course, when I got into the school, although I didn't know it then, but as I got older, I began to think about it. Is that being a Naskapi wasn't something I was really asked about in my own learning. So that has really being the reflective person that I am has really opened my eyes and ears and my heart too. Of what kind of learning are we allowing our students to engage in. And so through my teaching degree at Bishops University, I have an undergraduate and graduate degree from there. This is where a lot of this work comes from. It's when it started, where I began to think about it. But also the projects that I'm going to be talking about really come from those experiences. I I often describe it as I learned to become a teacher, a very good teacher in the Quebec education system. But when it comes to learning on the land, part of me feels that I'm unlearning how I was taught to be a teacher. And this is how I describe this journey of unlearning and also relearning what it means to be Naskapi teacher, meaning someone that teaches on the land herself, which is what I've been doing the past three years, and really reclaiming who I am as Naskapia teacher and not to be associated with uh, you know, a Quebec teacher, which I do not consider myself that. So, and with that, I've really done it not just reflect and think about it, but I've taken action. And it is through these projects where this is what it looks like of me taking action.

Stacy 5:59

Thank you for sharing your learning.

From Teacher Training To Unlearning

Stacy 6:01

One of the projects I think you've been working on is the Naskapi Niistim program. Could you talk to me a bit more about that program and how you're using the land to support the Naskapi language learning?

Loretta 6:16

So Naskapi Niistim, which means Niskapi first, is this idea of allowing our children to as Naskapi first. what does that mean? What does that look like? But also what does that feel like? And so that really came from my own son, who is autistic. His name is Cohen. And being in the school is something that was very challenging for him because the school is

Naskapi Niistim: Vision And Purpose

Loretta 6:49

the opposite of what it's like to be on the land, to walk on the land, to stand on the land. So thinking about my own upbringing, and you know how I said I was surrounded by stories, you know, stories really brought everyone together. Everyone carried a story. There was so much knowledge about animals and plants and teachings. I really wanted to bring that to children like my son. And so taking my own learning experience and knowing what the the education system can feel like for children like my son, who's autistic, I I began to really reflect on being on the land, and how on the land , I wouldn't, see the autism the way in the school you see it. And that is something that I've always experienced with Cohen at a very young age, you know, just taking him on the land and letting him be. Because on the land, you move at your own pace, at your own rhythm, and at your own time. When you're ready, you move forward. But in the school, it's this need to always move forward. So when I did Naskapi Niistim, it was really for kids like my son to feel uh that they can just be in a space that allows them to be uh in how they need to be, and for me to show up in the way they need me to show up. And so it took me about a year to really put down my ideas of what I wanted for Naskapi Niistim and to reflect of my people, but also the future generations. You know, I know children with special needs, specific needs in my community are the most vulnerable. And it's asking, not only as a teacher, but as a mom too, are we doing enough to allow them to be part of our community? You know, and I when I started it, I really began to question that. How are we showing up for these for these little guys who have been my greatest teachers? You know, I've been someone that always talked about the land, the need to be on the land, but these little guys show me what engaging with the land looks like, and it really opened my eyes and my heart of how we need to show up for them. So the the big part of what Naskapi Niistim is, and the vision I have for it, it's really a place for young learners that is centered in the Naskapi way of life through our seasonal teachings from the land and the caribou, and that uses storytelling to guide the Naskapi children in a deep connection to themselves and that the land that they walk on. And this is all done through Naskapi. So when it comes to language and culture, which are interconnected, they're not separate. Often they're talked about as separate, but they're really like part of your heart. The caribou was a big part of it because growing up, I would see herds of caribou, you know, and walking. It was like normal. The thought of a caribou never walking through our territory just seems something that it would was impossible. But unfortunately, in the last 15 years, it's possible our children are not getting that lived experience that I got as a child myself. And I often talked to the kids about this one time. Like I said, I was always hunting with my dad. It was a winter Saturday morning, nice cool breeze. I'd say it was February. And he him and I were going out in the bush just for a ride, which we often did. He always brought his rifle just in case we saw birds. And so he was driving through the middle of the lake. I was lying on a sled in the back, which was my favorite thing to do because I was I would just lay there and admire what was above me. So whether we were going through the trees, the forest trails, I saw trees. If it was in the middle of the lake, you saw the sky, the clouds, the sun. And this one time he just suddenly stopped in the middle of the lake and said, I see three caribou running into the forest. I'm going to detach the sleds to the caribou. You just lay here. Stay still. If an animal comes, play dead. You know, I was like eight years old, eight, nine years old. And he said, I'll be right back. I'm going to keep an eye on you, but I'm just, I'm just going to take my skidoo into the forest, you know, because it would be a hassle to drag me and all that. So off he goes, and I could hear his skidoo just going further, further, further away, and it's like complete silence in the middle

Pace And Belonging On The Land

Loretta 12:05

of the lake. Like there was not even a lot of wind. So it was just peaceful. And then I started hearing like these crunching sounds, like further away, but I knew they were coming, but I didn't want to move because I didn't know what was out there. And then they were coming from like my left, right, and head area and coming closer and closer. And then I hear like grunting sounds too. And then you the curious eight-year-old that I am, I looked like just took a peek to see what it was. It was like a hundred caribou crossing the lake, and I was in the middle of it in my sleeps. So I remember like panicking, but not reacting because I knew I remembered my dad's word of just play dead. So I could hear them just walk. They were walking, you know, they were just walking by. They weren't running, they were just like in the herd, just the way I've always seen. But to be in the middle of that, like it's it's something that happened what over 35 years ago, and it still lives in my head, like it just happened last winter. And the fog of their breathing, you know, and the cold winter mist, like you could, I just see it around me. And then sure long, not too long, that my dad sees this happening. So he drives the skidoo onto the lake to kind of scare them off, and then they just run off. But I remember just smiling. I wasn't crying, I wasn't afraid. I was just like, oh my god, wow, dad, did you see that? Like, just amazed. So when Naskapi Niistim came into play, it's those teachings, those lived experiences that like, how do you bring that to young learners? I take five, six-year-olds on the land and bring that to them. Like, how do you how do you do that in a time where we don't see this animal nearby? Uh, we people still go hunt, but they go like takes them two, three days to go north by ski-doo to get them. And by the time they bring them back, they've already been uh ready to you know be distributed to the community and all that. So we try to do as much teachings, but just that lived experience of seeing this beautiful animal who we the Naskapi people have always connected to in different forms, different ways, whether it's you know, ceremony, it's not just about food, it's about shelter, keeping warmth, you know, our moccasins, the hide, all of that, the bones and how they were how it was used. And behind me, you see me, the snowshoe, all come from the caribou, you know, and so talking to that about to kids, it's been a challenge, but they're really curious to know. So I have this little stuffed caribou that I found we call him (word for baby Caribou in Naskapi), which means baby caribou, and we practice this talking to him and asking him questions, but also getting messages from him, which is how you know, when we dream about the caribou, a lot of our uh drummers have played a traditional drum, the songs came in dreams, and so we would often like ask him, but him telling us things, and I tell I you know, I I bring in this part because from what I remember growing up, you know, honoring the caribou, remembering the caribou, that you're Niscapi, you're connected to the caribou. Although you might not see the caribou, you're still connected, and here are ways. And so Niscapi Nishim came from that, just me thinking about how can I bring these to kids, like my son, who you know has shown us as his parents that we have to go at his own rhythm, at his own place, at his own pace. And as his parents, being very mindful of that, and how can we do that for Cohen? And so when I started it, it wasn't just Cohen. There were other kids

Caribou Teachings And Adapting to the Land

Loretta 16:28

that, you know, students that were that needed just that break from the classroom. Even as an adult, sometimes I need a break from the building of school itself, and that's why I have a cabin, just so I can disconnect from this busy paced life and just be there to be there, to ground myself. And I knew that this was a big important part for these little guys, and so I would take them out every day, uh, full mornings, and the teachings that I would offer, although come seasonally, nothing was set in stone like we would in as a teacher, right? So, you know, we had at the time set up tents in this one area, and getting there was easy. The school had transportation, we would drive out there. I would always have an assistant with me. Her job was more like starting the fire, asking the kids to bring in the firewood, you know, that's a big part of work, you know, helping those around you. Then we would go inside and we had these tree boughs where we would sit around and I would bring like a little focus of the day is what I would call them. And I always, you know, started it with Atihuis, who was our main teacher. We talked about what we were feeling on that morning, whether we were tired, whether we were upset about something, you know, and this was all in a scapy. And because I knew a big part of my son's challenges was not being to say what he's feeling. And that's where these, you know, he'd often have these moments where we didn't know what he needed. So I was really teaching these kids to recognize what they were feeling, but also recognize where they were feeling it. Even as adults myself, you know, has having gone through my own healing journey, I've come to see how we were not given that space to talk about how we feel in our upbringing. My father's parents went to Indian residential school, so that was obviously cut off. And for my mom, well, you know, my people, the Naskapi People were nomadic until like the late 1940s. And so they were nomadic, but everyone had a job. You know, you had to do these things to survive, you know, a lot of resilience. And so, you know, there was never time to talk about how do you feel. And so with my program, that was a big part of my morning check-ins, I guess you could call them. Even too, I would talk to the kids, you know, I'd model that, you know, this morning I'm really upset because of this, and I really feel it in my throat, you know, it feels like this. So I'm gonna breathe. And then we would do these things together. And you know, five, six-year-olds, they got it really, and they were it was easy for them to be be vulnerable. I think it's like we made our own little community and being feeling safe. And I really believe because we were on the land, it felt safe. It was just us there, and I was sitting in a circle with them, and they didn't see me as the teacher, they just saw me as Lorette, you know, like the Aunt Lorette who's taking us blueberry picking, or we're gonna gather medicines and stuff. And so that's that's how that started. And parents have really appreciated it too in my community of that, you know, intergenerational trauma healing we're trying to do in our community. They were really, they really appreciated that their children were coming home and being able to say how they feel that they didn't realize that they could say. And so I was talking to parents about this. And a lot of them, the parents that I do talk to, I've already talked to them before because we were kind of in the same canoe of seeing that there's something about our child, but we don't know, we didn't know who to go to. And and this was before Jordan's principle came into play. How do we talk to the school about our concerns? You know, like it's you could it's easy to be feel alone. And so these other mothers came to me and said, like, how did you do it? How did you get your son to be seen by neuropsychologists? Like, things like that. And so I was already very close with these moms. And Cohen's dad, Patrick, was also being approached by other fathers, and because it can be very exhausting. And so they appreciated that part and they continued those conversations at home with their kids, with their other kids, you know, even them as parents. And they saw an increase in children's willingness to use the Naskapi word instead of the English word, because we are in a time where there's a huge shift in our language. Our young learners, I'd say 12-year-olds and younger, are not speaking Naskapi fluently, and we are very concerned as a community. So Naskapi Niistim really also stemmed from that of like, what can I do in the context that I'm at right now to help bring me this learning of language? And I did it in the way where I learned my language on the land. I didn't learn it in school, I learned English and French in school. But when I was on the land, it was Naskapi . I was expected to speak Naskapi. And I was surrounded by the words associated to the land, which can be very complex. But when you hear it and hear it and hear it, you have built confidence to use it. And that's exactly what I wanted to bring with to my learners. And I wanted to model that to the parents because there's this belief that the school is a place where our children learn .Naskapi And I'm saying, no, it's not, it's home, it starts from home, and here are ways you can start it at home. And then if they go to daycare, well, then it continues at daycare. And then when it gets to four-year-old, five-year-old, Jimmy Sandy, because they continue to learn the language up to grade two, like full immersion, they get an extra, you know, four or five years to learn it, but it still needs to be used at home. And so it's it's

Language Learning: On Land And At Home

Loretta 23:06

having these conversations with the community members, and this was one way of doing it. And like I said, I they've taught me so much, they've forced me to reflect of what is learning, you know, and who gets to define learning. And here I am as a Naskapi woman and also a mother, an advocate, telling the world that this is what learning means to us Naskapi people. And I always bring it to four pillars. Children need to connect to land, children need to connect to our elders, our knowledge keepers, children need to connect to the community and the community that they live around. And children need to connect to a knowledge. And through my program, I get to do to capture those four pillars and have students experience that, and has made me more a strong, confident advocate when it comes to what is learning, especially in a system like Quebec education, who are pushing more French on us, and you know, how do we bring our language, our children to be strong speakers when they have all these rigid, challenging obstacles around them. And Naskapi Niistim is an example of me taking action and doing what she knows based on where she stands as a mother.

Stacy 24:42

I don't know where to start because when you're speaking, there's so many things that were brought up. Just the emotions of being on the land and how healing it is for everybody. I went to a conference, an outdoor learning conference on Thursday, and we were all saying how behavior changes on the land, how students feel valued, they feel seen. And for us too as educators, you know, like just feels good to be outside, especially. I mean, down south right now, we have the leaves falling, and it's so beautiful. I had one of the teachers that were at the conference had participated on your day of the land, and she was telling me, oh, you know, like this is perfect for language learning. Like Loretta was there and she told me about how the color purple came from a berry up there, and we got to see the berry, and just like that experiential learning. Like, I don't know when she participated in your day, but she was like, it's been like a two, three years, and I still remember that berry means purple in Naskapi . So it was like, yeah, you know, just that experience of being on the land and being community, like when you're talking about the kids bringing in wood, like I think that's something we're all seeking. Like, you know, to feel part of a community and to see themselves valued and it's beautiful. Thank you for sharing. One of the things that came up a lot when we were at that session is like teachers see these benefits of outdoor learning and want to do that in their classroom, but they're not sure where to start. Especially some of them, they're in the city, you know, like they're in Montreal, they're in Quebec City, and they're like, How can I help connect students to the land if I'm not, you know, in the land, you know, or on a place where I can just open my classroom door and go outside and walk around and be free in my community.

Loretta 26:43

I think that starts with the teacher asking themselves, where do I stand right now? Like, where am I located in whether it's Quebec City or in Montreal? This is where I will start my journey. And so by that I mean, like, if I'm in Quebec City, who who walked these lands before I did? What was here before the school was built? And yes, you can find those facts in the history books, but you know, that's just one side of the story, trying to find people that can tell that story. So I had a great work experience by working at the First Nations Education Council, where it is in Wendaki. So I got to meet a lot of community members who are Wendat people, and their stories is something that I often think about. Like, how much do actually people living in the surrounding area know about these stories? Because for what they read in a history book is told by someone who probably observed their people or just retelling their story, but not allowing that voice to be heard. It's the same for the Naskapi people. We were nomadic until the late 1940s.

Four Pillars Of Naskapi Learning

Loretta 28:23

You know, history books say that we settled, you know, this willingness to settle, which is not how the elders experienced that. And at the time it was like I think the book said it like it was time for Naskapi to settle, like it meant it really meant the end of who we were as nomadic people. And those are stories I've never really, I never heard uh at school, but I heard from my elders who are always open to tell the truth. And so for the going back to the teachers is ask having themselves ask themselves that question, where am I standing right now? Who was here before me? And I do that too, even as a Naskapi woman, going to the different communities. I've worked for with 23 different communities across Quebec. And whenever I would go to their community, I would take a moment to honor myself as a visitor, and that I'm welcome here and I'm here to learn. So teachers can start there and having those conversations. Because I know one of the fears, like, what if I make a mistake or what if I, you know, um continue that the stereotypes, you know. But that's why I always say, you know, don't assume what you know about you know, those different nations that you know it all just by reading the books and getting to know the people and building those relationships who will tell you the truth of how their people experienced. you know, colonization and the education system today, even and our struggle trying to have fluent, strong, scapy speakers in an education set setting, it's it's not easy. Not doing it alone, asking their school boards, hey, I want to do this. How can you support me? You know, where is where are those people that can support me? And honoring those stories, honoring those people that will support you. And using those ways to bring into that voice into the classroom. So for outdoor learning, being on the land, well we're surrounded by land. You know, here Quebec City, there's different parks. That's been my way of bringing Cohen on the land, just to have those moments because he needs to be grounded himself. He needs to be surrounded by trees, by rivers. He's fascinated with water. So I always try to find a place that has a river where he

Outdoor Learning Tips For Urban Teachers

Loretta 31:05

can actually touch the water and throwing the rocks just there's something powerful that he hasn't been able to verbalize it, but I can feel it by just watching him. And so that's that could be something that teachers can do is talking to the children about relationships, the relationship we have to the land we stand on. Because the trees, the rivers, the rocks, the plants there's a spiritual relationship there. And having the students reflect on that. For example, like finding the names of trees which I've been doing like staying here in the Quec City area. Like what does it what what is that tree called? And we may not have the word in a scapy but I I'll then tell my ask my mother-in-law and describe it to her and she would kind of like try to find a word that oh it might look like this tree we have up here and that that we do that at a distance but also thinking about that tree and the the food it brings to an animal or to us as humans the tree who does it provide shelter for asking the students to think about that. And my responsibility to protect this tree you know having them to think about this need to because we need to protect Mother Earth you know for various reasons but this land is not just used by humans it's used by animals it needs the plants need the tree you know the tree also needs the plant and the water like it all is all interconnected and having those conversations with students it allows them to be connected to something bigger than just themselves. And you know it goes back to what I take I give back by honoring protecting and thanking and that's reciprocity right practicing that with students because that's how I remember my upbringing what you take from the land you give back in different other ways by sharing your you know the if I gather medicines I share the medicines with an elder or someone who's sick I prepare the tea for example for someone who's sick. That's me doing it. I still do it you know and so that's something that can be taught to our young learners whether it's in urban settings or not. And there's always some there's always people out there that are willing to help but it starts through building those relationships with those people first. And then that comes those teachings come like later when the the teacher like myself for example I'm always willing to help a teacher but I need to get to know the teacher first. You know what is your intention of doing this and of course I'll support it because it's a teacher not only just thinking about oh yes it's important we do this but actually doing it and talking about the experience of actually taking action which is I think a lot of other teachers need to hear that yeah you're in a vulnerable place because you don't know but that's okay. We don't know everything, you know so I feel like I'm leaving you speechless

Stacy 34:25

yeah you're leaving me with a lot to reflect on which is amazing I I guess I'll go to my questions and I'll reflect I'm gonna have to re-listen to the podcast and think through all of this because I feel really emotional like when you're talking about the connection between things and the tree you know it's so true and like it's leaving for the next generation I think is us we need to think about what seeds especially you know as educators and as parents what we're leaving for the next generation and it can start really small. It could be you know the little acorn from the tree having a little program and that could lead to much bigger things. So I'll jump into some of our other questions because I know we've been chatting for a while but I know you were involved in competency 15 when you were at FNEC. I was wondering what competency 15 means to you and I know you touched a bit on about like how teachers can get started. Why to you personally do you think it's important that all teachers develop competency 15?

Loretta 35:33

Well when competency 15 came about it was not something that we had planned it just happened although I was thinking about it when I was learning the teacher competencies at Bishops but when I the ministry had asked us to review and modify their current teacher competencies at the time there were 14 that's why this was 15 they had asked us to include Indigenous perspectives or First Nation perspectives and we were like okay yeah we're the right people to do that because you know the First Nations Education Council was there and I was part of it. And then as I as I was doing it given what I know and given my own learning experience at Bishops I come to realize how there was a deeper deeper knowledge or deeper information that teachers did not know. And it was probably very one-sided goes back to that you know who told you that story about the Naskapi for example and I felt that by being involved that way I was just doing this add and stir approach. Okay we'll throw in the word Indigenous or First Nation add and stir and then just to me continuing that systemic racism and leaving assuming that all nations are the same which is is still not the reality and so I remember saying to my boss then no I am not going to do it this way because this is not what we want as First Nations people. And I think that it's time that we have our own if it's something that's being reviewed I think at the time it was like 10 years ago that was their last revision I was like we're gonna wait another 10 years to do this. I was like no we have to have our own so he was like okay well then you tell the education directors and the chiefs of why and how you want to do it. And so they gave me the stage I shared and I really shared from my own experience of a student, a learner going through the education system but also a teacher learning to be a teacher in the education Quebec education system but also someone that was really connected to her roots her people the land and so I shared my journey as that and just like what I'm doing with you right now and why it's important that we have it. And they were all like yes finally we need something so we went to the ministry and said hey this is what we're gonna do. We're not gonna do it your way but this is how we're willing to do it. And they're

Reciprocity, Relationships, And Care

Loretta 38:25

they were pretty much left speechless because they're like okay you know they were never asked to do this. They're like okay you have five days to do it and I was like okay I got five days I'm gonna do it and I was kind of nervous about the five days but I knew it was like no I have to do something I have to bring that voice and the voice is really from my own lived experience as a learner as an ascappy little girl but also as a teacher. So the way it's created it's really this ongoing reflection it's not did you do this but this is how you can do it. This is how you can use this competency to develop your different areas so we do it like a lot of historical but we really tie into the storytelling part whose story am I bringing to the classroom for example we do a lot of the building relationship with the students but also the families because the families and students that come into the school it it goes both ways building relationship with community members outside of school which is a big part of something that we ascampy people want of our teachers it's not you know a fly in you'd go teach and then you go home it's really how are you supporting the community outside of the school and so when we wrote it that way it was really done a way where whichever community I go to for example I will always bring competency 15 with me because there's always new opportunities to learn. It's not a check check check sometimes like it feels like this kind of work I can see it sometimes that it's a check we've done it once we've done our part of reconciliation for example and so it was done in that way to honor this idea of being a lifelong learner and you know competency 15 in the cover has two rivers merging to one which really comes from my master's research. When I wrote about that my own lived experience of a student entering a school system and then leaving the school system and being home on the land for example on weekends it always felt like I had to leave my canoe to go paddle the other canoe. I was never given the opportunity to paddle just one canoe on one river or I can bring both of those rivers with me because yes I know I had to learn English and you know the the Quebec education system which today I get to use you know through these conversations I have with teachers but also honoring that that river of who I am as a Naskapi learner. You know merging it's really the image shows they're merging two rivers to one and paddling forward. And so we wanted to really highlight this and the competency because we wanted teachers to be mindful of shifting their minds of I'm an expert to I'm a learner reminding themselves that they're continuing to paddle. Whether you feel like you're just getting on your canoe when it comes to you know decolonizing education which I don't really like to use the word unlearning I guess you could say their learning journeys and where do you start are you already on your canoe are you just getting on or do you feel like you're you know just hitting a current or is it smooth sailing all of that to be very reflective and it goes back to that relationship with the land and that's how competency 15 came to be and my hope for it is that teachers you know always ask themselves whether it'd be every season and not just September 30th of where do I stand on my learning journey? Do I bring in the stories of other nations into my classroom do I bring music of other nations to my classroom I when I was a teacher here in Quebec City English school board we were doing a unit on recycling but to me recycling is not just you know putting these things in recycling bin it's that what does the land mean to you and I remember using uh Florent Vollant and Claude McKenzie song Akua Tuta which means take care of it and I remember taking those lyrics listening to Inu because I can speak four languages innu being one of them and then trying to write it out using the the letters so that my students could follow along but also putting in the English translation and I had fit it into one page and we were practicing Akua Tuta and there was that one verse that I would always have them sing. They couldn't sing the whole song but they sang that one verse and we were practicing and I kept telling them about you know this song in Innu and is about us protecting the land. So recycling is not just about putting things in a blue bin it's like why are we putting things in a blue bin it's to protect the land you know the the garbage and things that take longer to to decompose and all that. So it's uh it's something that I wanted people to be very reflective and mindful of how can you take an everyday topic of teaching like recycling but finding different ways to take it further and at a much more deeper connection and there are so

Why Competency 15 Was Created

Loretta 44:16

many ways you can do that. It's just up to the teacher of maybe not their readiness but their willingness to take action because Quebec has been one of the slowest provinces to move forward when it comes to this type of work and I've seen it you know I've traveled across Canada I've heard of other schools of what they're doing and it's like okay let's go Quebec we gotta we gotta do better for this generation of young little guys like my little Cohen who wants to be honored as a Naskapi Innu boy but also in a Quebec education system. And that's what I'm doing with him is trying to have him find his voice.

Stacy 44:59

It's amazing I'm just thinking even about your example of recycling how recycling is really the how right like the deeper meaning is that we're connected to the land and we're protecting it. And that as a student makes so much more sense to instill that value rather than focus on the how because the how can change we can move from recycling it one way to another way later down the road. And yeah it's just a beautiful way to instill those values in youth.

Loretta 45:30

Yeah because they are the ones that are going to be our future leaders you know they're the ones that are going to be advocating for like the need to protect the land not being afraid to ask you know like in Schefferville there a mining company, you know, and our high schoolers in my community are asking those questions. And so they live in this world of we mine for jobs but it's also the mine has disrupted the caribou herd and having those conversations you know and and they're in what sec two three and so in the future I see them as people who will be sitting around these powerful tables and saying hey wait a minute for us not how we see it and to have that voice. And I feel like even myself as an Ascampi woman in the education system today. And I still sometimes wonder how I got to be here it it really started from sharing my voice. At first I was always shaky and scared because I was raised to never question the white man you know that's how my father and mother were raised themselves like my father when parents went to Indian residential school and but then growing up to say but wait a minute we have to ask these questions because if we don't then who's going to ask these questions and so you know working within my own school board I asked these questions as a Naskapi woman and even more so today I'm not afraid because there are questions that need to be asked that no one else is asking thank you for asking those questions for all of the youth I think and uh thank you for so much for everything.

Stacy 47:25

I'll I guess I'll I could keep talking for you to you for hours but I I know the day can get away with us and how quickly time can go and I value your time but thank you on behalf of myself because I was learning and reflecting a lot but also for the teachers that are going to be listening and can continue to reflect on what else they can do in their classrooms in light of competency 15 to make those little steps and not have to be the expert but just little steps at a time

Loretta 48:22

Right they are the learners and they have to accept that as is and the day on the land that's that's been my my direct message to them you're not here to learn by hearing the language because it's the elders that are the expert teachers you're here to learn by seeing the elders do it.It's not so much of what they're doing in the words that they're using as they're doing it's just you looking and reflecting of how can I bring these learning opportunities back into my classroom. And there's that shift right away you're not the expert you're a learner here and this is who you are on this day at this space with the elders who are the the experts themselves and that's been a struggle for some but some it's been a wake up call for them to remind themselves as they continue their learning journeys.

Stacy 48:54

It's a huge shift for some going through a very Eurocentric system where you're a student in 30 in the classroom and you're told to sit down to being somewhere that you might not be comfortable where you might not know.

Loretta 49:10

Yeah and I always tell them don't bring your notebooks you just got to feel this this moment and you know when you go back to your classroom think about well what can you do with what you saw or who can you invite or how can you take your kids to that person and and redo that teaching with your students because I'm sure your students know a lot about what this author is doing because that's just everyday things that we do. But so as a teacher how do you build on that to make the real learning more relevant to the students that are that are around you because it's also healing for us and it's safe to do this you know as the Scap you people with our children. And uh just a little side story. I remember when I did the the day on the land the first year we've I've been doing it for eight years and it really came from when I did my master's research where I asked the community members what do teachers what do new teachers need to know when they come work in our community it was really my question. So elders and community members and parents and teachers and they said they need to know what's important to us Naskapi people they need to know what we value and that comes from being on the land that comes from the elders being the teachers and so that's how the day on the land started that like okay if I could be given a day to bring these teachers out on the land and have these different learning opportunities. And the first year I was trying to be very like rigid in my planning first we're gonna do this this this this you know like just how an elementary teacher would do it. And the elder that I was working with him and I honor his teaching his name is Jacob Mameanskum he's been following me for the past eight years and he's every year he just he's more confident

Two Rivers to Paddle

Loretta 51:00

himself of being an elder with white people you know because he's someone who doesn't speak English. So he gets nervous too of I'm you know being surrounded by 10 English teachers you know and I remember telling him okay this is what I'm gonna do first and he said I'm gonna stop you right there in the scapegoat which he was saying you know your paper which is your degrees that your you your papers do not belong on the land and I'm the one that's gonna say how it's gonna go because we got to think of the weather we got to think of you know sunrise sunset and the seasons and all that and someone could have felt offended like hey I I have a master's degree you know but I wasn't at all like oh yeah I gotta put myself in place here you know and and I was really quick and I always go back to that you know what would Jacob say to me right now if I'm feeling like this what would Jacob say to me now if I want to do this and he always tells me those that want to learn will learn. Those that are ready to learn will learn. And it's up to that person of their willingness to learn and that's how the day on the land began to really become bigger than I could have ever imagined I always just focused in my community but it's just expanding different organizations want to join and people the Central Quebec school board staff have been flying in and I'm very strict on who gets chosen because it's not just anyone it's like if you're coming this is what you're expected to do and are you ready? Yeah and it's been a wonderful experience I think for those teachers too but for my community and the elders too because this is us Naskapi people the very small community across Quebec doing such great work and if it wasn't for my elders in my community it would have not have expanded the way it has yeah

Stacy 52:52

thank you for sharing I'm thinking when you're telling the story of your elder kind of reminded me again of competency 15 of those two rivers you know you're coming with like the teacher plan and then it's like no wait we have to think of the river like what's going on today so it's really showing exactly what competency 15 about what people are doing. For the day on the land is , how can teachers Who are interested in learning more or attending, who can they reach out to

Loretta 53:49

well they could reach out to me I work for the Central Quebec school board so my you have my email address but if there are different school board members they should reach out to their director of their principal first maybe their director of educational services to say hey there's a day like this if it's not being offered to them as a school board well from there we can figure things out it's always the transportation issue because teachers are flown in the morning and then flown back the same you know the same day we've only done one day but I think this year they encourage teachers well the teachers that teach at Jimmy Sandy to sleep out there as well and we have a beautiful cultural site now so it's really we have the space now and if it's something that they really really would love to we do it every September and it's on a Saturday and if it's their school board uh is willing to put in the help financial aid or or whoever there's a lot of money out there they can apply for grants and stuff well there's always that option too so emailing me more they could also email Rebecca who is really close connection with me and then from there it's definitely something that can be a rranged.

Stacy 55:16

Well thank you I think it's an amazing amazing idea and programs and when I went up to Kativik I would have loved to have a day on the land because those days eventually you know when we went out as with the students on cultural days those were when I learned the most we were in a Hammutik and we were sharing food together that's when I was really like touched to continue my work and building relationships with students so I think it's such a beautiful example of a how an orientation could be for new teachers to a school board. So thank you for sharing and I hope that it continues to grow your program and that many teachers will attend.

Loretta 55:58

Thank you so much